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Ap lockheed copy caliper

Discussion in 'Norton Commando Motorcycles (Classic)' started by baz, Sep 20, 2018.

  1. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    Has anyone used the light weight alloy calipers that are usually for sale on eBay for about £130 as opposed to the £230 ish genuine AP racing calipers?
    Are they any good? There's usually a reason why something is cheaper ! Cheers
     
  2. JimC

    JimC

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    “There's usually a reason why something is cheaper ! Cheers”

    And it is more than likely not good.

    That £100 saved won’t go far on a hospital bill or funeral.
     
  3. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    That's what I was thinking!! Hence the question
     
  4. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    One is sold by a highly regarded expert in the field, with a reputation to maintain.

    The other is not I presume?
     
  5. JimC

    JimC

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2007
    Don’t know anything about eBay knockoffs. I did use a Grimeca 2p copy of the Lockheed . No problems.
     
  6. kommando

    kommando

    Joined:
    May 7, 2005
  7. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
  8. RoadScholar

    RoadScholar VIP MEMBER

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    Dec 28, 2008
    Don't critical motorcycle/car parts have to meet minimum industry (government regulating body) standards?
     
  9. Madnorton

    Madnorton VIP MEMBER

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    Jun 9, 2008
    Yes, but If you are thinking CE approved no, however with no dust seal - track use only these days, as per the warning on the AP packaging.
     
  10. Fullauto

    Fullauto VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2009
    Who would that be?
     
  11. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

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    Oct 4, 2013
    AP.
     
  12. Steves

    Steves

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2016
    Are they not made by Grimeca? (The replica)

    Ok disregard, I see there is a Lochheed replica of unknown provenance. Grimeca is like 17 quid more, was thinking of putting one on the back wheel of a build, having 2 AP's on the front.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2018
  13. kommando

    kommando

    Joined:
    May 7, 2005
    I thought I had read they were commissioned as AP forgot they had made them and stocks ran out despite there being a demand, after the copies appeared AP remembered and made more. Wassells may be the company that commissioned them.
     
  14. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    i have a pair of genuine AP racing calipers on the front of my triumph i use it all year round on the road ,never had a problem with them, i didn't fit them so didn't know there was a warning on the packaging! so now i have something else to worry about
     
  15. lcrken

    lcrken VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    I've also used the original AP calipers on several street bikes with absolutely no problems. No idea what the dust seal issue might be.

    Ken
     
  16. olympus

    olympus

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2017
    Same on my T160, never had a issue with them, but to be fair never used in winter
     
  17. Matchless

    Matchless

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2010
    I have just fitted three of the AP copy calipers to a T160 I'm building for a friend. They seem to be nicely made with good threads fit & finish, but without cutting one up to check the casting I can't say any more. Only time & use will tell. I have however used the Grimeca ones & they work well. The most annoying thing about this type of caliper is there are no anti rattle springs fitted as standard.
     
    MichaelB likes this.
  18. SteveA

    SteveA VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2011
    The replica AP items are identical to the AP item with the exception of the brand marks being deleted. So it is easy to tell what you have, even if you don't actually know where it was made.

    There has always been a demand for thse calipers as they are use by a lot of classic racers on 2 and 3 wheel, so I would discount stories that AP weren't making any, there have been regular supplies of AP CP2696 over the last few years.

    Apparently they are made on new tooling. I have one, but have yet to use it. Agree with Matchless that they look nicely made. Visual inspection alongside one of my CP2696 4 rib AP items says that externally it is a very good copy!

    Before actually using it I anticipate purchasing a genuine AP seal kit and popping the pistons out for a further inspection! If the fitted seals are of a similar appearance and fit I would say it should be functionally good. But clearly others are using them now.

    One of my bikes has a genuine period AP 3 rib item fitted to the rear and I was going to swap it out for the copy, and if I am happy with the fitted seals on the new caliper this one will get the new ones.

    (I also have 3 copies of Honda CB500/Kawasaki round screw cap master cylinders purchased from David Silver. I have 3 race seasons on one with no issues regarding quality and have just fitted one to a road bike.)

    On the Grimeca calipers, which are fit and function identical to the AP, but of differing form/appearance, I know several people racing with them who are very happy with performance. They use the same pads as the CP2696, may be a fraction heavier, but have a little more clearance to wheel spokes than the AP items.

    By design they are a race caliper not a road caliper, but clearly there are a lot of the AP versions on the roads. Unless you are planning rides in all weathers and on salty roads, and you are prepared to strip and clean them occasionally I can't see lack of a dust seal being a problem. In fact on other Japanese road calipers I have used on road and track bikes over the years the crud build up behind the dust seals has actually been the main problem, causing sticky pistons.

    Not having anti rattle springs doesn't worry deaf old racers much o_O
     
  19. Frankie17

    Frankie17

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2015
    CE approval is a Euro conformity to ensure manufacturers have correct enviromental and health and safety process in place ? product groups requiring this do not include Automotive parts themselves
    this covers things like electrical items gas appliances and machinery etc not automotive parts AP the manufacturer may have CE approval but that is for meeting the process criteria as a manufacturer operating with in the EU it is a requirement and there will be a disclaimer on the product regarding useage

    the Globaly recognised automotive quality managment is TSI 16949 .2016 and QS9000 if these are held by the manufacturer ( CE ) Euro approval is only relevant to the manufacturing process

    i have used the AP replica calipers and some brembo replicas on a porsche 911 which bear the same manufacturers signature these have been sucessfully stopping a 911 from 150mph for the past two years without issue and were 25 percent of the purchase price of genuine Brembo
     
  20. kommando

    kommando

    Joined:
    May 7, 2005
    CE is also self certified, the manufacturer who adds CE mark to his item is supposed to have done the required testing and has kept the results in an accessible location for inspection. There is no requirement for the testing to be done independently so the process is open to abuse evidenced by all the mobile phone chargers that self combust.