A real kicker of a question

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robs ss

robs ss

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Okay, since others are broaching potentially touchy subjects, here goes...

What is your view on the correct way to kickstart a Commando (life of isolastics, elf & safety, yadayadayada):

1. On the centre stand,
2. On the side stand,
3. Neither - good at balancing/timing, or
4. Something else (Fast Eddy's "920 method" might fit here)

BTW no discussions of electric boots shall be permitted!
 
Hi Rob, as for kick starting a Norton the best thing to do is learn to kick it without any use of side stands or centre stand as in the long run you will wear them out or break something and not your leg unless the bike falls on it, after I converted my Commando to the Featherbed frame I ran without any stand on it at all for over 25 years just leaning it on a fence, post or side of a house its only the last 10 years I had a clamp on side stand and would be no good kicking the bike while on that stand and my motor is a high compression motor, getting the knack of kicking it and you won't need to use a stand.

Ashley
 
ashman said:
Hi Rob, as for kick starting a Norton the best thing to do is learn to kick it without any use of side stands or centre stand as in the long run you will wear them out or break something and not your leg unless the bike falls on it, after I converted my Commando to the Featherbed frame I ran without any stand on it at all for over 25 years just leaning it on a fence, post or side of a house its only the last 10 years I had a clamp on side stand and would be no good kicking the bike while on that stand and my motor is a high compression motor, getting the knack of kicking it and you won't need to use a stand.

Ashley
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My featherbed 500 is the same Ash , but then it doesn't have a centre stand.
I suspect that kicking on a side stand would kill the side stand.
 
Option 3 where possible, which for me is most of the time with standard ish bikes.

However, ergonomics can play a part, low clip ons etc can make it difficult.

Throw in a daft high CR motor and it can became downright dangerous!

I believe that often option 2 (side stand) can be ok. If ones timing and balance is correct, the stress of the kick is not actually transferred through the stand.

But if ones timing and balance is not correct, and / or if the motor is a really daft high CR job, the side stand may cop some load.

If the side stand does cop the load, repeated use can damage the frame.

If the centre stand ever gets damaged, it’s very straightforward to change.

Therefore, option 3 is best (balance). If you can’t do that then option 2 is possible but risky (side stand). So if in doubt go with option 1 (centre stand).
 
Kicking whilst sat on the bike with neither stand down was always my preferred option but now I have put the RGM T160 style kickstart on I notice it's more awkward.
 
That's the first negative I've heard on the RGM kicker, have been thinking of purchasing one of these. Do you think the MK3 kicker might be a better choice for a hard to kick over engine?

Glen
 
worntorn said:
That's the first negative I've heard on the RGM kicker, have been thinking of purchasing one of these. Do you think the MK3 kicker might be a better choice for a hard to kick over engine?

Glen
Click to expand...

I got an RGM kickstart fold out lever for my MK3 and it doesn’t work with the standard rear disc master cylinder setup. It’s been a while but I couldn’t find a position on the kickstart shaft that didn’t foul the master cylinder.

Maybe others had better results on a MK3?
 
worntorn said:
That's the first negative I've heard on the RGM kicker, have been thinking of purchasing one of these. Do you think the MK3 kicker might be a better choice for a hard to kick over engine?

Glen
Click to expand...
A real kicker of a question

It's not that it's a hard to kick over engine, it's just more awkward as it's sits higher and more forward than a stock one when kicking sat on the bike.
 
Never ever kick on the prop stand. This is for temporary parking only. Do not kick on the centerstand either. Freestart only.
 
Best would be starting with no stand
Second would be on center stand
And third best on the side stand
I have owned 3 commandos none of which had a center stand
I've never had a problem with side stand lug/frame but I don't put a strain on stand when I kick it
I now have an Rgm folding kickstart and rear sets
The kickstart lever is at approximately 45° to the bike but it's the only way I can start it with my left leg because my right knee is bolloxed
So nowadays the Alton starter takes the strain
 
Chiming in for those of us in the lightweight class. Centre stand unless I'm out by the side of the road or on soft ground then it is side stand.
No way on God's Green Earth that I can kick it over sitting on its wheels. With the Trident I can but just barely.
 
When the 750 Atlas first came out, the engine was in a very detuned, 7:5 :1 pistons e.t.c. and having brought one like a speed hungry guy that I was I tuned it and upgraded it. 10:5 :1 pistons went in which meant I had to learn how to balance the bike with both feet off the ground, getting the ing timing and carbs right became a big thing in my shed. The hours I spent, I'll never get back. I was more fortunate than some people because I had learned how to kick over a big 500 single with a magneto that also required lots of attention to stop me being stranded. The general piece of advice in those days was not to use the stand- it wasn't designed for it, if this sound trivial I once saw a 4ft 8 inch girl kick starting her 750 Triumph twin to life at Euston station, my kind of woman!
 
First start of day , on center stand with my left leg , after that usually can get it started while balanced on seat ...
 
Gotta love all these confident statements about kickstarting without a stand – suffering as I do from Duck's disease, the only way I can achieve that is if there's a kerb handy. :( If you have extra inches, just be grateful.
 
Dommie Nator said:
Kicking whilst sat on the bike with neither stand down was always my preferred option but now I have put the RGM T160 style kickstart on I notice it's more awkward.
Click to expand...

I have no problems at all kicking my high compression motor to life with the T160 kicker as I have said the first kick for the day is a full swing on the kicker, once started for the day I can sit on the seat and kick my Norton to life with half a swing on the kicker, but of course the Joe Hunt is great for that with its big hot spark.
My stock kicker use to sit in the back of my leg when riding and I couldn't have my right foot completely on the foot peg but the folding kicker is right out of the way when riding, as well my stock kicker use to come loose on the shaft after just a few kicks, so far the T160 kicker stays tight all the time and I have gone through 2 stock kickers before the folding one.

Ashley
 
Onder said:
Chiming in for those of us in the lightweight class. Centre stand unless I'm out by the side of the road or on soft ground then it is side stand.
No way on God's Green Earth that I can kick it over sitting on its wheels. With the Trident I can but just barely.
Click to expand...

I was a light weight with chicken legs when I first brought my Norton new at 17 years old and never used my stands to start my Norton as well I knew 2 young ladies who were even slimmer than me both had kick start 850s and they had the knack of kicking them to life without using the stands, found out later one of the girl's her father was a Norton man and taught them both how to kick their Nortons from a young age.

Ashley
 
I kick it over while balancing on the wheels, because all of you have made me paranoid that I will destroy either, or both of, my stands. Before I came to this site, I kicked it over on the side stand and over the 30+ years of doing that, my side stand got sloppy, but the '70 side stand is easy to replace as long as the frame plate is solid.

When I was young, I had the head shaved down, eliminated the base gasket, and use the flame ring head gasket, so I upped the compression. Of course I didn't really know that I also needed to maybe change to a hotter cam and do some porting work to really get some significant extra horse power, so all I got was a bike that's harder to kick over with the normal horse power.... Hey, I was young and didn't see the big picture...
 
"I believe that often option 2 (side stand) can be ok. If ones timing and balance is correct, the stress of the kick is not actually transferred through the stand."

That's the way I kicked my original Commando back in the day and the way I kicked my current one for 6 years. As noted, there is less weight on the side stand when you "kick" than there is with the bike just sitting on the stand since the weight of your body as you do the kick unweights the side stand. Never had any issues with bent/broken side stands.

It depends on your ability/size/balance, etc re starting "on the wheels" but I never felt anything but totally unstable any time I tried that.
 
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