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A lot of bad feelings arising.

Discussion in 'Access Norton Pub' started by norton bob, Oct 8, 2019 at 1:56 AM.

  1. norton bob

    norton bob

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    The recent death of a young rider and the rapid extraction to the USA of the driver of the car using "diplomatic" immunity is causing a lot of bad feelings. Its also probably unnecessary as it was most likely a genuine accident caused by a momentry lack of attention which is understandable . It raises a lot of questions though that need answers.
     
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  2. Time Warp

    Time Warp .......back to the 70's. VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2012
  3. ashman

    ashman

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2010
    All deaths from any accident should be taken seriously and if the person involved should be held accountable if at fault, if the person skipped the country where it happened and to use "diplomatic immunity" means there is more to it than what's been told and matters taken to bring this person to account for a death, hiding behind diplomatic immunity is not right, but then could this person live with some ones death if it was proven to be caused by them, that person will have to live with that for the rest of their life.
    Well this is my opinion and have just read the story about it, this person should be held accountable and accept responsablity if at fault.

    Ashley
     
  4. norton bob

    norton bob

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    The sort of questions that this hiatus invites are, was she drunk,on drugs or more likely on the phone?, She has done bad stuff before in the USA. Does the base have BIG signs at the gate "DRIVE ON THE LEFT". Is it routine for the staff there to drive on the right in the base and switch at the gate?.Hope not. Investigations after the event are important to learn from.
     
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  5. Onder

    Onder

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    You have to abide by the law and sometimes the law is simply not up to the task. If you have an accident where somebody gets killed you
    will eventually have to face the music so best to get representation and take your medicine.
    Diplomatic immunity is often used for the wrong reason.
     
    baz likes this.
  6. kommando

    kommando

    Joined:
    May 7, 2005
    The charge would have been death by dangerous driving, they also would have added lesser charges as that death one is hard to prove and is normally dropped unless there was clear signs of say racing or a rage driving. I suspect in this case the only charge that would have stuck is driving without due car and attention, a fine and a driving ban would have been the result. It would be dealt in the local Magistrates court, a 3 man bench with no jury.
     
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  7. Fast Eddie

    Fast Eddie VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2013
    I agree with Kommando, dangerous driving means you knowingly do something wrong, ie racing, driving whilst knowing you’re tired, driving at a dangerous speed, etc.

    This lady accidentally went onto the wrong side of the road, as she’s from a country that drives on the wrong side. She clearly wasn’t applying due care and attention. But unless she was deliberately on the wrong side, or was driving at a dangerous speed, etc it would be highly unlikely she’d be convicted of dangerous driving.

    Nevertheless, she killed someone, I don’t really understand diplomatic immunity, but surely it’s not there to allow diplomats to go around killing the citizens of their host country without at least facing due process for their actions !?
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2019 at 7:08 AM
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  8. norton bob

    norton bob

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    The wife of a "diplomat". Its likely that as a relative of an intelligence Officer? she would be vulnerable if her ID becomes common knowlege ,being generous that could be enough reason to pull her out. Not handled well though.Can't see Trump making any usefull input, Diplomacy not his strong point.
     
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2019 at 7:23 AM
  9. Lineslinger

    Lineslinger VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2017
    There is a different level of justice for the wealthy and those in power....they can run or buy their way out of it.

    This is not over...too much notoriety...no place to hide...if the UK decides to extradite said offender it should be honored...whether it will or not is up to the wealthy and powerful.

    The whole diplomatic issue and hiding/running from the responsibility of a tragedy said offender caused is bullshit cowardice.
     
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  10. baz

    baz VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    if I were her I would have to face the music
    Diplomatic immunity or not
    How on earth could you live with yourself???
    No doubt she didn't do it on purpose but probably just through being careless, so why not just come clean??? whatever happens a bloke is now dead!!!
    And she has left the country
    Forget about the laws and immunity it is morally wrong!
     
  11. MikeG

    MikeG

    Joined:
    May 31, 2012
    The whole concept of diplomatic immunity seems wrong to me. No matter what your governmental ranking, you are still a guest in the host country and should be made to obey their laws and customs anywhere outside the embassy/base.
     
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  12. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    An 'accident' is an act of God. Anything else is an incident. - Manage the risk.
     
  13. norton bob

    norton bob

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2013
    I well understand the need for protection of diplomats. For me the breaking point was the shooting of a Lady police officer who was there protecting the Embassy and shot from within the Embassy by a "Diplomat" ,later allowed to leave without even a question. There has to be rules.
     
  14. acotrel

    acotrel

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    Jun 30, 2012
    Getting outraged about motorcyclists being killed on public roads is stupid, regardless of what punishments are involved. When you ride on public roads, you know the risks and you tolerate them - sometimes you lose. If you drive a car in city traffic, sometimes you get rear-ended and you usually walk away uninjured. The likelihood of it happening is very high. If you ride a motorcycle, the potential consequences are different. That is the reason, I choose to road race. I don't want to be killed by some inattentive idiot. So I go to where the risks are controlled.
     
  15. Eljahara

    Eljahara VIP MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2018
    The outrage is not about the death of the rider, we all know that accidents/incidents occur where the outcome is tragic. The issue is the unwillingness of the other road user to accept responsibility for her actions and hiding behind her husbands diplomatic status.
    As has been said, at most it would probably have resulted in a fine and a driving ban, unless the driver was somehow culpable or under the influence of drink or drugs - no accusation just speculation.
     
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  16. ashman

    ashman

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    Jul 11, 2010
    Al we know you don't want to ride on the road and we all know the ricks involved in riding motorcycles, but if this woman was on the wrong side of the road or whether she was drunk at the wheel or what ever she did she needs to come clean and respect the laws of the country she is in and doing what she did by running proves to me there is more to it, she can hide but it will be on her mind for the rest of her life, that's if she has any guilt at all.

    Ashley
     
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  17. Triton Thrasher

    Triton Thrasher

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2009
    Her skipping the country is bad.

    But diplomatic immunity is in place and it’s not going to change.
     
  18. Onder

    Onder

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    When I lived in New York, one of the most common things is "diplomats" at the UN who, on a daily basis, ignore all violations especially parking, as they are able to simply toss them without worry. When you note what it costs to park in the city for the rest of us it is hard not to wonder just how this goes on.
    And mind you, this is only parking, they can ignore all the other laws as well.
     
  19. norton bob

    norton bob

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    Nov 29, 2013
    From what I hear they do not have immunity. And never did have.Sounds like they were badly advised. Embassadores job anyone??.
     
  20. Lineslinger

    Lineslinger VIP MEMBER

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    Feb 26, 2017
    My son went to college and continues to live in Washington DC. The liberties taken via diplomatic status be it parking or getting a table at a restaurant sets off that slow burn in me...especially the arrogance of entitlement often displayed.
     
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