23-time TT winner John McGuinness says he can put the Norton SG7 on the podium at TT 2019.

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MCGUINNESS AIMING FOR PODIUMS WITH NORTON IN 2019
23-time TT winner John McGuinness says he can put the Norton SG7 on the podium at TT 2019.
The Morecambe Missile was forced to miss the 2018 TT after re-breaking the leg he originally broke at the North West 200 in 2017. Nevertheless, McGuinness threw on his leathers to complete a couple of parade laps on the Norton at TT 2018.

“It was either go around at 60mph waving at the crowd, or get stuck in! So I got stuck in a bit and did 121+mph on the second lap waving to the crowd, so it was encouraging. There’s still a little bit of magic left!”

After completing these parade laps, and making a winning return at the Classic TT in the Bennetts Senior race, McGuinness believes getting on the rostrum is an achievable goal for himself and the iconic British marque.

“[A podium] is a realistic result. I really do believe that we could stick that Norton on the podium. Watching the races, it’s only really Peter [Hickman] and Dean [Harrison] that lifted the bar, Conor [Cummins] was probably going the same speed I was going on the Honda a couple of years ago. I’ve been working it out in my head, looking at the sector times, I’ve done my homework on it, watching Peter’s lap over and over again to see where he’s making the time up, and he’s not doing anything massively different to what we are, but he’s the man to beat! The Norton’s sweet, it’s been a reliable package, Josh [Brookes] got the bike round at just under 132mph, and you don’t get a bad bike around at that speed!”

McGuinness was speaking with Steve Plater at Motorcycle Live. You can see the full interview here.
 
Good to hear he's confident in the machinery. I was disappointed he didn't ride this year's IOM TT.
 
With some nice looking new models released, it would be great to see Norton get a podium, with an experienced rider and reliable bike it is very possible. In the last couple of TT's I think that the Norton race team have realised that the reliability needs to be there, irrespective of what rider you have.

Just look at Honda, roughly 10 years ago they said on ITV that they would not use a GP bike on the Island, look what happened when they did, Guy Martin spat off after his gearbox acted like a random automatic, and a nasty smash in Ireland just weeks before, road circuits are punishing on the whole set up, GP bikes are not strong enough. They forgot or some of the team moved on and took the knowledge with them.
 
Honda didnt bring the GP bike, they brought the newest Fireblade the CBR1000RR. It was the lack of testing that blighted the bike and roadracing is not the way to find out where the bikes weaknesses are
 
What is a better way to find out what a bike's weaknesses are, than road racing ?
 
Is it clear yet whether Norton are using their own engine or sticking with the Aprilia unit?

Using the new 1200 unit would be a challenge this year me thinks!
 
Is it clear yet whether Norton are using their own engine or sticking with the Aprilia unit?

Using the new 1200 unit would be a challenge this year me thinks!

I believe that 4 cylinder bikes are limited to 1000cc (someone please correct me if I’m wrong) therefore I’d imagine they’ll stick with Aprilia motor.
 
That’s correct but I was lead to believe at the NEC that they would be using their own engine, reduced to 1000cc. I won’t say who from Norton told me that as I don’t want to get them in trouble.
 
Well if they do that it’d be great.

Heck of a risk tho!

Guess we’ll have to wait n see...
 
I believe that 4 cylinder bikes are limited to 1000cc (someone please correct me if I’m wrong) therefore I’d imagine they’ll stick with Aprilia motor.

Why do you keep insisting on calling it the Aprilia motor? They haven’t used an Aprilia motor for years. It was only used in the beginning when they were developing the bike.
 
Well something is going on with 2 very similar product lines developing from 2 companies

2019 Norton V4 1200cc plus Twin superlight 650cc

2019 Aprilia V4 1100cc plus Concept Twin 660cc

When you consider Garners comments ref having to redesign every part on Kenny Deers prototype which ended up looking just the same as before then you have to take Garners view that the V4 is a complete redesign with a pinch of salt.
 
Why do you keep insisting on calling it the Aprilia motor? They haven’t used an Aprilia motor for years. It was only used in the beginning when they were developing the bike.

The racer has had the Aprilia motor in all along. The Norton motor has not raced at the IOM yet.
 
Well something is going on with 2 very similar product lines developing from 2 companies

2019 Norton V4 1200cc plus Twin superlight 650cc

2019 Aprilia V4 1100cc plus Concept Twin 660cc

When you consider Garners comments ref having to redesign every part on Kenny Deers prototype which ended up looking just the same as before then you have to take Garners view that the V4 is a complete redesign with a pinch of salt.

Are you saying you don't trust the pram salesman?
 
I also have my doubts about the ‘totally re desigend’ claim for the 961.

The 1200 is very much a totally new motor though. Designed in collaboration with Ricardo.

Whether or not Aprilia are also involved in the collaboration in some way, I’ve no idea. It has not been stated anywhere as far as I’m aware.
 
A bit off topic but today I was about to go out but the midday movie was a 1935 comdey about a TT racer the movie was called No Limits set on the Is Man, there was actual footage of the real racers of the time and bikes, it had some funny set up crashes, one where a rider missed a corner and crashed through the front door of a pub and of course a few patrons drinking at the bar and the anouncer saying " at lease it was opening time " of course the hero won the race and the girl.

Ashley
 
I also have my doubts about the ‘totally re desigend’ claim for the 961.

The 1200 is very much a totally new motor though. Designed in collaboration with Ricardo.

Whether or not Aprilia are also involved in the collaboration in some way, I’ve no idea. It has not been stated anywhere as far as I’m aware.

Riccardo Motorcycle (now based in Germany) has had Piaggio as a customer for many years. Piaggio own Aprilia so there is a common link.

https://www.cyclenews.com/2016/08/article/everything-wanted-know-norton-v4/

The engine has been developed in conjunction with the former Vepro design consultancy in nearby Coalville, 10 miles away from the Norton factory at Donington Hall. Founded in 1999 by Triumph’s former Head of Engine and Transmission Design, Neil Wright, Vepro was acquired in October 2014 by design industry giant Ricardo to form Ricardo Motorcycles, and has been working on the new Norton projects since December of that year. An industry leader ever since its foundation in 1915, Ricardo has worked ever since then on developing new vehicles with any number of wheels for companies all over the world, from Ferrari to JCB, Volkswagen to Piaggio.

Regardless of the changes you make you do not use an engine for basis of your own without either getting a lawsuit or having a joint venture contract in place. Having the same engine design contractor means costs are shared but you can also vary the engines enough so they are not exactly the same.

“Of course, if you have a fast TT racer you’ll have a fast road bike, so that works really well even though the 1000cc RSV4 motor has a slightly narrower 65° cylinder angle, whereas the 1200cc Norton V4 has ended up at 72°. But in spite of being 200cc bigger our motor is actually physically smaller than the Aprilia, so it fits in largely the same hole that the Aprilia left in the frame, which of course is very good. But that’s not because it’s an ultra-short stroke design, it’s just the way we’ve designed the architecture of the motor, with the biggest difference being that the balance shaft on the Norton V4 is beneath the crankshaft so that it ends up being a really short motor, whereas the Aprilia’s is in front of the crankshaft, making it longer. So we can get our 1200cc engine in the same space in the chassis that they got their 1000cc motor.”

https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/new-bikes/2017/september/norton-v4/

“Our engine bears almost no resemblance to the Aprilia, our engine is more compact then theirs, despite being 20% bigger in capacity.


'Almost no resemblance' sounds like politician doublespeak but then I am a cynic.

No doubt the contract requires both parties to act in a certain manner so the truth will never be revealed, unless it breaks down at some point.

Norton have designed and sold rights to the 650 engine to Zongshen

Guess who also has a joint venture with Zongshen

23-time TT winner John McGuinness says he can put the Norton SG7 on the podium at TT 2019.

Company Profile IntroductionContact Now
ZONGSHEN PIAGGIO FOSHAN MOTORCYCLE CO.,LTD.
  • Business Type:
    Corporation/Limited Liability Company

  • Main Products:
    line operation motorcycles, scooters, engine, spare parts and after-sell service; non self-made motorcycles, scooters, engine and import and export for spare parts. Wholesale, retail business and relative after-sell service

  • Major Markets:
    South America,Southeast Asia,Africa,Oceania,Mid East,Eastern Asia,Central America,


http://www.cccme.org.cn/shop/cccme11393/index.aspx
 
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A bit off topic but today I was about to go out but the midday movie was a 1935 comdey about a TT racer the movie was called No Limits set on the Is Man, there was actual footage of the real racers of the time and bikes, it had some funny set up crashes, one where a rider missed a corner and crashed through the front door of a pub and of course a few patrons drinking at the bar and the anouncer saying " at lease it was opening time " of course the hero won the race and the girl.

Ashley
George Formby picking up an Inter outside Bracebridge St.

and his doppelganger taken at the Classic TT in 2017View attachment 8779
 
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Riccardo Motorcycle (now based in Germany) has had Piaggio as a customer for many years. Piaggio own Aprilia so there is a common link.

https://www.cyclenews.com/2016/08/article/everything-wanted-know-norton-v4/

The engine has been developed in conjunction with the former Vepro design consultancy in nearby Coalville, 10 miles away from the Norton factory at Donington Hall. Founded in 1999 by Triumph’s former Head of Engine and Transmission Design, Neil Wright, Vepro was acquired in October 2014 by design industry giant Ricardo to form Ricardo Motorcycles, and has been working on the new Norton projects since December of that year. An industry leader ever since its foundation in 1915, Ricardo has worked ever since then on developing new vehicles with any number of wheels for companies all over the world, from Ferrari to JCB, Volkswagen to Piaggio.

Regardless of the changes you make you do not use an engine for basis of your own without either getting a lawsuit or having a joint venture contract in place. Having the same engine design contractor means costs are shared but you can also vary the engines enough so they are not exactly the same.

“Of course, if you have a fast TT racer you’ll have a fast road bike, so that works really well even though the 1000cc RSV4 motor has a slightly narrower 65° cylinder angle, whereas the 1200cc Norton V4 has ended up at 72°. But in spite of being 200cc bigger our motor is actually physically smaller than the Aprilia, so it fits in largely the same hole that the Aprilia left in the frame, which of course is very good. But that’s not because it’s an ultra-short stroke design, it’s just the way we’ve designed the architecture of the motor, with the biggest difference being that the balance shaft on the Norton V4 is beneath the crankshaft so that it ends up being a really short motor, whereas the Aprilia’s is in front of the crankshaft, making it longer. So we can get our 1200cc engine in the same space in the chassis that they got their 1000cc motor.”

https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/new-bikes/2017/september/norton-v4/

“Our engine bears almost no resemblance to the Aprilia, our engine is more compact then theirs, despite being 20% bigger in capacity.


'Almost no resemblance' sounds like politician doublespeak but then I am a cynic.

No doubt the contract requires both parties to act in a certain manner so the truth will never be revealed, unless it breaks down at some point.

Norton have designed and sold rights to the 650 engine to Zongshen

Guess who also has a joint venture with Zongshen

23-time TT winner John McGuinness says he can put the Norton SG7 on the podium at TT 2019.

Company Profile IntroductionContact Now
ZONGSHEN PIAGGIO FOSHAN MOTORCYCLE CO.,LTD.
  • Business Type:
    Corporation/Limited Liability Company

  • Main Products:
    line operation motorcycles, scooters, engine, spare parts and after-sell service; non self-made motorcycles, scooters, engine and import and export for spare parts. Wholesale, retail business and relative after-sell service

  • Major Markets:
    South America,Southeast Asia,Africa,Oceania,Mid East,Eastern Asia,Central America,


http://www.cccme.org.cn/shop/cccme11393/index.aspx

So there may well be a link / collaboration somewhere, and as you say, we may never know.

Nevertheless, I think it’s important to note that irrespective of any link, we are talking about a ground up new engine.

We are not talking about the current Aprilia engine being ‘pseudo redesigned’.

Personally, I don’t think it matters a jot if there is some kind of collaboration going on. It happens all the time in the auto industry, and given the huge costs of designing an engine from scratch, I’d say it was a sensible thing to do.
 
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