1964 650 SS

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Please.
A friend of mine has bought a stock 1964 650 SS on the stand from more than ten years.
Cleaned well the 376 monoblock, pilots and jets are free, trottle needle 3th groove hold in place.
Valves setted as x manual; good compression both cylinders.
Magneto sparks well and checked setting to 32 BTDC.
Magneto's leads properly on their spark plugs.
Fire arrives to the new spark plugs.
Bike doesnt start, hundreds pedal lever kicks without any engine burst.
What we must check better?.
Thank you.
Piero
 
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texasSlick

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Try switching leads on plugs. The timing may be set up 180 degrees out.

Does spark look blue or yellow?

Try kicking as follows:
With kick lever, advance engine until mid-way up compression stroke. Pause 5-10 seconds, return kick lever to full stroke, then kick hard. This technique fires magneto into less compression.

Are spark plugs wet or dry?

Try one of these to check spark quality with plugs installed in engine.
You should get a large flash.

Slick
 
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If the plugs are wet with fuel ,focus on ignition. If plugs are dry focus on fuel delivery,try a squirt of fuel into the carb /s if it fires then it most likely fuel issue.
 

texasSlick

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Could be the AAU blocked?
Doubtful. Remove points cover. With your fingers, you should be able to advance points rubbing block. You said in original post "Magneto sparks well and checked setting to 32 BTDC."
The AAU must have been tested for proper advance when set to 32 BTDC.

Read again and answer questions in my Reply #2, and Reply #3.
 
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Has the mag ever been rebuilt (capacitor replaced) ? They can spark in open air but fail to spark under pressure especially with insulating fuel. Then is the magnet strong enough?
High speed push start may be the only way to know, if low speed kick does not work!
 
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Bodger

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I know this is a dumb question, but have you checked fuel is getting to the carbs? When you tickle the float does fuel eventually come out of the tickler? Drying fuel can sometimes glue the float needle to its jet. Assuming you have "chopped" Monoblocs, If you remove the jet cover on the right hand carb idle jet does fuel run out?
 
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Could be the AAU blocked?
Has the mag ever been rebuilt (capacitor replaced) ? They can spark in open air but fail to spark under pressure especially with insulating fuel. Then is the magnet strong enough?
High speed push start may be the only way to know, if low speed kick does not work!
thank you.
nothing to know about mag, seller too old to remember.
i will tray with high push start.
piero
 
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I know this is a dumb question, but have you checked fuel is getting to the carbs? When you tickle the float does fuel eventually come out of the tickler? Drying fuel can sometimes glue the float needle to its jet. Assuming you have "chopped" Monoblocs, If you remove the jet cover on the right hand carb idle jet does fuel run out?
Sorry but fuel line works and tickler too and fuel trun out from main jet cover.
But this bot a dimb question, what you mean happened to my G15.
 
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Have you switched the plug leads over as texasSlick suggested in his first reply? Seems the most obvious and easiest to check - yes I've done it in the past
 

Burgs

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Have you cleaned the points, they get an oxide coating on them when left for that long, it may show a spark but you need a nice fat blue spark as per Texas Slick suggested.
Burgs
 

texasSlick

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Read again NortonBob's suggestion Reply #3.

Place a cc of petrol in each carb, or spray 1 second starting fluid in each. If the engine fires and runs for a second or two, you have a carb problem.

If no fire, you have a timing or ignition problem. Get a spark tester to be certain.

As you know nothing of the history of the magneto, the internal capacitor may be bad, (dynodave, reply #6), or the magneto magnet may be weak. Recently, my magnet became weak. After a magnetic boost, the engine fired off on first kick.

What color is the spark when you check with plugs removed? Spark should be blue (Burgs Reply #6).

Slick
 
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For a weak spark, you could always put some pencil lead on the spark plug business end, . . .
 
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The worst thing you can do is go bouncing off the walls thinking and looking at everything ( unless you do it for 10 mins and get lucky!) , Its fuel or sparks , eliminate one and work on the other.
 

texasSlick

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Piero:

This magneto is over 56 years old. It is most likely never been renewed. Most likely the original Lucas capacitor has failed. Time alone causes this to happen. Consider sending the magneto to a competent rebuilder. There are several in the UK.

Slick
 
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Piero:

This magneto is over 56 years old. It is most likely never been renewed. Most likely the original Lucas capacitor has failed. Time alone causes this to happen. Consider sending the magneto to a competent rebuilder. There are several in the UK.

Slick
Hi.
I was usually to send my magneto to "Bright spark magnetos" in Uk (i liked replaced with the easy cup condenser), but now they didnt repair them anymore.
Could you point me to a reliable alternative?
Thank you.
Piero
 
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texasSlick

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Piero:

Here are some to consider.


I do not have any experience with any of the above.

Perhaps some of the UK members can chime in.

Slick

EDIT: 1/29/21

After reading the thread regarding the troubles of buying/shipping from the UK after Brexit, you might consider sending your magneto to the US for repair.
I would heartily recommend Doug Wood (dougwood@netzero.net).
 
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holtcorseaux

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Hi Piero,
Dave Lindsley did outstanding work for me on magnetos and dynamos in the past = not later than 1980. I would not hesitate, he must be one of the best.
To be honest, I spend far too much on parts from everywhere in any case and being in Switzerland have always paid crazy money, the cost would not be a killer criterium.
Hope you find a good man. I want a 650SS as well.

Martin
 
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Hi Piero,
I can recommend Priory Magnetos. He recently rebuilt my k2f and did a great job. He did it the same day he received it! I think it was about £300 for a complete overhaul, new armature, bearings, etc.
He’s not vat registered, so doesn’t charge vat. That brought the price down quite a bit.

Matt
 
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