Welcome to the Access Norton Forum. Login as a VIP member to remove the advertising banners.


Oil Change Demon

Modern 961 Norton Commando Motorcycles

Oil Change Demon

Postby BritTwit » Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:49 pm

Just about to do an oil change on my 961 CR.

First snag: Found that I can’t get an allen wrench up between the X-Pipe and the sump plug.
The SBN X-Pipe blocks the head of the plug from all angles.

Backup plan “B”:
Remove SBN silencers, and X-Pipe to access sump plug.

Next snag – I can’t get the X-Pipe free of the header pipes. Wiggle to the right, wiggle to the left, wiggle up wiggle down, over, and over, and nothing.
Tried whacking it with a rubber mallet, and extension, no movement.
Appears the techs at my dealer's shop applied liberal amounts of sealant on the exhaust joints. Now they are virtually welded tight.

Backup plan “C”:
Any suggestion from 961 owners who have encountered, and defeated this maintenance demon?
1975 850 MKIII Commando
2013 961 Commando Cafe Racer
2006 Triumph Bonneville T100
2003 Ducati 999
User avatar

BritTwit
Posts: 795
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: NYC

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby Britfan60 » Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:23 pm

Yea. Take it to Gold Coast and complain. Let them do it. At 48 bucks for the oil and 35 for the filter, its worth the extra 50 bucks to laugh while they try to unweld your friggin X pipe. After they serviced mine twice, I would swear they wrenched on the dip stick. I had to use a pliers with a leather glove under it so I don't mar it, to open it. Once I checked the oil when I was there, asked then why the hell its so damned tight, he marred my cap because he only used a paper towel under the pliars. They can be real idiots some times. Thumb tight, bone heads. Sorry you ran into those problems, Ed. Spray some lube oil and try again.
Access Norton VIP Paying Member
Britfan60
VIP MEMBER
Posts: 863
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2014 5:56 am

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby BritTwit » Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:50 pm

I hear you,

The reason I wanted to do my own oil change is because of my last experience at GC.
The mechanic put the oil filter cover on backwards and upside down.
I was in a rush to get out and back home, so didn't notice the screwed-up cover until I was home in the driveway, screaming obscenities inside helmet.
Neighbors must have though I was stoned.
I would just like to avoid another such event.

Maybe I'll call GC tomorrow, and find out what technique they use on oil changes.

To be continued.
1975 850 MKIII Commando
2013 961 Commando Cafe Racer
2006 Triumph Bonneville T100
2003 Ducati 999
User avatar

BritTwit
Posts: 795
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: NYC

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby TonyA » Tue Aug 23, 2016 9:02 pm

The Norton X-pipe allows access to the sump drain plug on my bike . But if memory serves , the SBN exhaust has no mount under the frame , so just unbolt the head pipes at the head and take off x-pipe and head pipes together.

TonyA
Posts: 774
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:14 am
Location: Milwaukee WI. USA

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby BPHORSEGUY » Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:01 pm

I use a long socket type Allen wrench that fits between the pipes.

BPHORSEGUY
Posts: 646
Joined: Fri Nov 29, 2013 2:24 pm
Location: Suffield,Ct

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby Fultonrn » Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:40 pm

I reduced the length of the shorter leg of an Allen key that I could fit over the exhaust pipes and into the drain plug then with the longer arm coming out between the exhaust and sump of engine I found a short length of tube slid it over the Allen key long leg and easily removed the sump plug without removing the exhaust when I found the exhaust which is the standard system on my SF was obstructing the vertical insertion of an Allen key into the sump plug.
There is just enough room to carefully reinsert the plug after oil drain .
I managed to drain and change oil thereby without removing any exhaust part.
On the Mk 2 with new crankcase breather kit there is a non return valve in a pump to oil cooler hose.
One is told to remove both oil hoses from pumps to drain oil cooler but unless one disconnects the non return valve in the pipe to cooler it in theory will not drain.
I left it attached in the oil pipe by its special clips and its pipe connected to the oil pump and measured all oil drained from the engine oil system and believe the mayo ritzy if not all oil had drained from the system without disturbing this non return valve.
The short leg of the required Allen key can easily be cut with an angle grinder or similar.

Fultonrn
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 3:25 pm

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby BritTwit » Sun Aug 28, 2016 4:54 pm

Yes,

with the standard X-Pipe the sump plug can be removed.
However, with the SBN X-Pipe, the crossover is further forward on the X-Pipe and completely blocks the sump plug from below.
The only other option is to cut down the short end of an allen wrench and try to insert it in the tight space between the top of the X-Pipe and the engine sump.
Easy to do perhaps with dainty lady hands, but not with my man hands. :lol:
1975 850 MKIII Commando
2013 961 Commando Cafe Racer
2006 Triumph Bonneville T100
2003 Ducati 999
User avatar

BritTwit
Posts: 795
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: NYC

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby contours » Wed Sep 21, 2016 4:43 pm

What is the exact hex key wrench size for the engine oil drain plug? I am having my doubts about what fits and I don't want to strip it on the first oil change! 5.5mm goes in easy, but feels loose. 6mm doesn't quite go in. This ain't rocket science! Maybe I am partial to old school methods, but why in the world did Norton decide to use hex key in the first place?! :x
2015 Norton 961 Sport
2013 H-D XL883N
2006 Triumph Speed Triple 1050
2003 Triumph Daytona 955i (sold)
1975 Norton 850 Commando Mk3
User avatar
Access Norton VIP Paying Member
contours
VIP MEMBER
Posts: 571
View Photo Album - Images: 9
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:39 pm
Location: Readsboro, VT

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby TonyA » Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:22 pm

The drain plug should be 6mm allen

TonyA
Posts: 774
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:14 am
Location: Milwaukee WI. USA

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby contours » Wed Sep 21, 2016 6:25 pm

TonyA wrote:The drain plug should be 6mm allen


Thanks once again, Tony. I guess I need to remove the exhaust pipes to get a proper fit. :oops:
2015 Norton 961 Sport
2013 H-D XL883N
2006 Triumph Speed Triple 1050
2003 Triumph Daytona 955i (sold)
1975 Norton 850 Commando Mk3
User avatar
Access Norton VIP Paying Member
contours
VIP MEMBER
Posts: 571
View Photo Album - Images: 9
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:39 pm
Location: Readsboro, VT

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby contours » Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:41 pm

Okay. Well, I removed the back half of my exhaust system without too much struggle. I then proceeded to insert my 6mm hex key wrench and discovered more play than I had hoped for. Unfortunately, I could not get that thing to turn ... even after an ample application of Liquid Wrench! So now I am a bit nervous about applying too much leverage for fear of stripping the socket. Does this seem abnormal?! There has been only one oil change performed previous to this and it was done by the guys at MCC. :(
2015 Norton 961 Sport
2013 H-D XL883N
2006 Triumph Speed Triple 1050
2003 Triumph Daytona 955i (sold)
1975 Norton 850 Commando Mk3
User avatar
Access Norton VIP Paying Member
contours
VIP MEMBER
Posts: 571
View Photo Album - Images: 9
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:39 pm
Location: Readsboro, VT

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby richard-7 » Thu Sep 22, 2016 5:29 pm

They tightened it too tight.
1977 Suzuki GT500 2-stroke Cafe Racer
2014 Norton 961 SE #112
My Flickr Account Photos
ONE07 Flickr Account Photos
iStock Motorcycle Pics
User avatar

richard-7
Posts: 936
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2014 11:31 am
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby BritTwit » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:21 pm

contours wrote:So now I am a bit nervous about applying too much leverage for fear of stripping the socket. Does this seem abnormal?! :(


I understand your feeling.
Had the same experience, ended up putting exhaust back on and taking the bike to the dealer.
They have a fabricated special tool with a welded allen key bit on the end that fits perfectly.

Funny, but view the Norton oil change video from youtube made by Norton Canada below:
https://youtu.be/I2pkEmt_Bqw
It shows an engine hex head sump drain bolt.
WTF!
Don't know when Norton changed to allen head bolt, but it's yet another bad idea from the factory.

Matt at CNW - here is another opportunity for you - make a replacement sump plug with w/12 or 14mm hex head.
End of problem.
1975 850 MKIII Commando
2013 961 Commando Cafe Racer
2006 Triumph Bonneville T100
2003 Ducati 999
User avatar

BritTwit
Posts: 795
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:15 pm
Location: NYC

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby TonyA » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:50 pm

Well I guess it must be tight. Is there a chance that the drain plug has been rounded out previously ? The drain plug is a 6mm allen. You can opt to remove the sump plate that the drain plug is in if all goes to hell. That way you can get it drained and if necessary get that plug removed while it is off the bike. Have you thought about using an impact driver with a 6mm hex bit to loosen it ? The 6mm allen should fit with very little play.

TonyA
Posts: 774
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2015 10:14 am
Location: Milwaukee WI. USA

Re: Oil Change Demon

Postby contours » Fri Sep 23, 2016 5:13 am

TonyA wrote:Well I guess it must be tight. Is there a chance that the drain plug has been rounded out previously ? The drain plug is a 6mm allen. You can opt to remove the sump plate that the drain plug is in if all goes to hell. That way you can get it drained and if necessary get that plug removed while it is off the bike. Have you thought about using an impact driver with a 6mm hex bit to loosen it ? The 6mm allen should fit with very little play.


I was wondering about that, Tony. At least that way I could get a good look at the condition of the socket once the plate is off.
2015 Norton 961 Sport
2013 H-D XL883N
2006 Triumph Speed Triple 1050
2003 Triumph Daytona 955i (sold)
1975 Norton 850 Commando Mk3
User avatar
Access Norton VIP Paying Member
contours
VIP MEMBER
Posts: 571
View Photo Album - Images: 9
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:39 pm
Location: Readsboro, VT

Next

Return to Norton Commando 961 Motorcycles

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: BritTwit and 0 guests