Not another spindle thread!

[swooshdave]

Hey, at least it's not a breather thread.

So I got Windy's clamps today.



And as you remember from my build thread I also have the Old Britts spindle which has both the MkIII flats and the tapped hole. Why they put the flats in the pre-MkIII spindle I have no idea (was it for the MkIIAs?).



Anyways... it was brought up in another spindle thread (imagine that there were more than one of these...) by Paul to use the flats to locate the bolts from Windy's clamps (or any fixing bolts you choose). I was talking to Windy and he didn't think it could be done but wasn't very convincing so I said I'd take a look at it.

So measuring the distance, roughly, between the center of the flats and the locating hole I get an inch.



So I center the clamps approximately an inch out from the locating hole and they are almost to the cradle.



I don't have the swingarm bushings yet but I loosely assemble the swingarm and it looks like the bolts Windy supplies may be too long. I'll try with the actual parts and such and perhaps button head bolts will work better. But I think it will work.



Are the lock nuts really needed? The clamps are threaded so wouldn't a bit of Loctite be enough?

[Hortons Norton]

Dave you need to be sure to drill the holes in the proper location so the bolts don't hit, Did he send the instructions with them? I would also use the nuts as they lock them in place. I will look and see if I can find the instructions tomorrow when I get home from work, Chuck. The spindle probably has the cut outs so they can be used on both models.

[bill]

dave
if you look at the instructions i e mailed you it will show the proper orientation of the clamps. with the 1/4 top bolt at 12 o clock the clamp bolts should be at approximately 7 to 7:30 . THAT was why I had reservations about trying to use the flats because the flats will be at the wrong angle to the bolts.

[mike996]

If I understand this spindle issue correctly, the purpose of the clamp (or welded nuts/bolts/whatever) is to ensure the spindle cannot pivot on the central fixing bolt. So whether the clamp bolts bear on a flat or not doesn't seem to me to have any impact, pro or con, on the function of the "fix." As far as I can see, locating th bolts against the flats wouldn't improve the clamping, even if the angle is correct. Or am I missing something?

[debby]

The problem is the bolts don't quite contact the flats. They contact the edge of the flats, at an oblique angle. Won't work.

You could flip the spindle over as suggested, but another problem is that the new spindles do not appear to be hardened and the bolts gouge the surface of the spindle, forming a little crater that will make it extremely difficult to ever remove that spindle again.

I decided not to run the clamp screws down on my 850 because of that. YMMV, good luck.

Debby

[highdesert]

The purpose of the clamps is to keep forward pressure on the spindle against the bushings.
This lessens the amount of looseness by having worn bushings, and therefore reduces swing arm movement,
improving handling.
If you r bushings are in good shape and the spindle is a good snug fit then, in theory, you don't need
the rings or any reason to keep the spindle snug in the bushings.
Just my understanding.

[swooshdave]

dave
if you look at the instructions i e mailed you it will show the proper orientation of the clamps. with the 1/4 top bolt at 12 o clock the clamp bolts should be at approximately 7 to 7:30 . THAT was why I had reservations about trying to use the flats because the flats will be at the wrong angle to the bolts.

Why do the bolts have to be a the 7 o'clock position, it's that just to clear the swingarm, not for any other reason?

[swooshdave]

The problem is the bolts don't quite contact the flats. They contact the edge of the flats, at an oblique angle. Won't work.

You could flip the spindle over as suggested, but another problem is that the new spindles do not appear to be hardened and the bolts gouge the surface of the spindle, forming a little crater that will make it extremely difficult to ever remove that spindle again.

I was proposing having the bolts at the 9 o'clock position, thus centered and contacting the flats squarely.



Not to scale, just a sketch.

[Hortons Norton]

I would do it the way Heinz says to, The purpose is not to help worn bushings but to help worn cradles. Also the position is critical to how the pressure is applied to the cradle, Follow the instructions if you want them to work.

[swooshdave]

I would do it the way Heinz says to, The purpose is not to help worn bushings but to help worn cradles. Also the position is critical to how the pressure is applied to the cradle, Follow the instructions if you want them to work.

I thought the purpose was to prevent the cradle from wearing.

I still haven't heard of an explanation of why they have to be offset.

I assume that it's to clear the swingarm and there is no other reason.

Or that they follow the older fix of welding nuts to the cradle tube was done that way and it's was easier to do it at that angle with the swingarm installed.

[grandpaul]

I don't see why you need the single OEM set bolt if you are using the double clamp-on bolt fixes, and I would bolt them to the flats on the spindle. If the ends of the bolts mar the flats, the spindle can still be pulled out. Of course, plug the single OEM hole to keep debris out.

[Hortons Norton]

If you trim the bolts and narrow the nuts you will be able to place them that way, But I would place them as far out towards the plates as you can. This will help more with the rocking, Here is Heinze Keglar's e-mail: Heinz500@aol.com He can answer your questions.

[swooshdave]

If you trim the bolts and narrow the nuts you will be able to place them that way, But I would place them as far out towards the plates as you can. This will help more with the rocking, Here is Heinze Keglar's e-mail: Heinz500@aol.com He can answer your questions.

They are already almost as far out as they can get. Perhaps another 1/8in at most and I can't see that making that much difference.

[Hortons Norton]

Then drill away and be done with it.

[swooshdave]

As soon as I get my bushings I'm going to fit it all up and see how short the bolts need to be to clear the swingarm. Then I'll drill and install.

I have to think that pushing against those nice flats they provide has to be way better that trying to press against the round spindle (even if you manage to drill some divots).

Stay tuned. Probably this weekend.



These should fit just so and provide plenty of clearance for the swingarm. Still a bit of measuring and drilling to go. Oh and I have to get the swingarm bushings in. I think I'm still looking good for this to work.