Dances with Shrapnel wrote: I don't know where beng is getting his "FACTS" on old race motors versus the new stuff out there but I am pretty sure Axtell & others were eclipsed a few years later. I know Kenny can wring the sh*t out of his motor weekend after weekend and not have to look into it till end of season and his is a very good motor.
No can do with flimsy OEM stuff.
You are not disputing anything I said, I am merely passing along information that is available to anyone that cares to look for it.
The 1975 Cycle World article "Dirt Track Limousine" states Wood and Axtell used 68' or 69' Commando cases to make 77 rear-wheel horsepower, they ran 43 races that year and DNF'd in three of them. Where was the Norton 750 that eclipsed those numbers " a few years later"? Or the AHRMA Norton with any better record of reliability? Facts that DWS infers but does not provide.......
If anything, "a few years later" Norton technology and power went away. Axtell quit making his parts and Wood quit racing and there was no equivalent parts until the last few years, it was 20+ years before vintage racers got back to Axtell power levels or eclipsed them. Fact.
The only other fact I mention is the flow and velocity charts put up on this very forum by the Fullauto port developer comparing the Fullauto and Axtell heads, which graphed almost identically to each other.
Wood and Axtell were racing for real, against XR750s and other state of the art competition with real AMA experts, they were not bored millionaires/playboys running a few races against each other in vintage events each year.
If someone wants to replicate Axtell's porting I would first read Smokey Yunicks book on building Chevrolet small blocks that has the word "secrets" in it's title, it has a good history of porting technology and what works in poppet valve ports and what does not. It has the exact ideas used by Axtell in his Norton ports. Also carefully read through the posts put up on this forum on Norton head flow by those successful in racing and making money selling Norton head work, and things are pretty well spelled out.
There is nothing magical about Axtell's porting, it was just smart and a product of experience. Axtell used stock sized valves in a regular Commando 750 head. He kept the port cross section uniform the length of the port, which was about 30.5mm at the manifold flange. He left the floor alone and as high as possible, kept it straight for as long as possible above the valve seat, and did make it bigger where it went round the valve guide, once again to keep the cross section uniform where the guide took up space in the port.
With today's knowledge of port flow and behavior it is common sense that someone should be able to replicate Axtell's ports or do even better if they spent a little time researching the subject.
Most spare old Norton engines laying around have histories of use in street bikes, not racers, and have lots of life left in them for a sensible vintage racing effort using a sensible redline of 6000rpm, at which Woods engine was pumping out 67hp at the rear wheel, enough for fun?
In the early days of vintage racing, when it was still actually historical, that is what was used, real vintage chassis and engines. There are plenty of the same parts vintage racers used in the 80s laying around to be used now by sensible riders interested in history and fun more than big numbers and their egos, the same parts that Wood and Axtell used, Norton cases, Hepolite pistons and stock rods and heads.
Vintage racing in the USA today is not historical or vintage at all. The types of bikes and their proportionate numbers have nothing to do with what was raced in the 1960s or 70s. It has decayed into a freak show of machines that no one in the 60s or 70s ever saw or could obtain. In the country that saw the majority of the world's motorcycle production flood into it, the machinery is certainly here, but the racing has been corrupted into a farce by bored hobbyists that have no personal history with the racing of that era and who have put their egos and selves over what it should be.