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G15 Questions

G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:11 pm

I've got a couple of questions about the G15CS I just picked up

#1 - Was the CSR designated as G15CSR on the engine case? There are some pieces on this bike that do not jibe with the CS bikes I've seen, but match some pics I've seen of CSRs, such as the chrome chainguard, chrome fork shrouds instead of gaiters, apehangers as seen on the last batch of CSRs and the large rear fender also found on the G15 MkII and some CSRs I've seen pics of.

#2 - did any G15s come with alloy instrument perches? Here's a pic of what I've got:
Image
This bracket puts the instruments up at a 45 deg angle which is fine, but would block the view of the high-beam indicator and ammeter in the headlight shell.
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby Paul W » Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:32 pm

Hi Bill,
The instrument bracket is the same as Norton Atlas/650SS (similar to the P11 but slightly different hole centres) as they too are Norton Roadholder.
ATB.
Paul.
1969 Commando S
1968 P11 Ranger (x2)
1966 650SS
1957 Model 30 International
1953 ES2
1939 Triumph Tiger 100
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby Matt Spencer » Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:01 pm

Ive seen a couple ( ebay pictures ) with the CSR engine No. , G15CSR so presume the stampings the i.d. , on the cases if not the frame .
The Japanese response to ' styling ' , was to add more .
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:20 pm

Matt Spencer wrote:Ive seen a couple ( ebay pictures ) with the CSR engine No. , G15CSR so presume the stampings the i.d. , on the cases if not the frame .


I was just asking because I've never seen a CSR in person, so I don't know if the factory stamped the engine G15CSR/

I do know the serial is stamped on the headstock, left side, and it's only the six digit - no model designation on the hybrid frames.

I think I'm going to do a straight CS restoration and keep the ape hangers, chrome chain guard, big rear fender, alloy binnacle and fork shrouds in the attic. It'll be cheaper to replace that stuff than to re-chrome it anyway.
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby Bernhard » Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:06 am

Paul Webb wrote:Hi Bill,
The instrument bracket is the same as Norton Atlas/650SS (similar to the P11 but slightly different hole centres) as they too are Norton Roadholder.
ATB.
Paul.


Dommi Roadholders fork yolks had 7 inch centres, Atlas/Commando 7 3/8 inch.
Don’t assume that the bike will follow the sales literature as it does not always follow the style that left the factory.

Absolutely loads of images on internet;
http://classic-motorbikes.net/gallery~Matchless-G15
http://classic-motorbikes.net/images/gallery/13030.jpg
http://classic-motorbikes.net/images/gallery/9586.jpg
http://classic-motorbikes.net/images/gallery/10292.jpg
http://classic-motorbikes.net/images/gallery/10286.jpg
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=mat ... ORM=HDRSC2

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Re: G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:56 am

I've seen those pics, Bernhard. Nothing I've seen so far matches what I've got.

The bike has the 2.4 gallon tank with the pins on the back for elastic mounting.
The bars are about a 12" rise and look like the ape hangers I've seen pics of for the last batch of CSRs.
The chain guard is chrome
The rear fender looks like a MkII rear fender, but slightly bobbed at the back like the Ranger rear fender. There's a reinforced hole with a bolt through it that attaches to the tab on the back of the seat. The fender is made up of perhaps 8 separate pieces of steel - the main part is two pieces, lapped under the edge of the seat and spot welded. There are small brackets on each side with a bolt and acorn nut, and seem meant to mount lifting handles and tie the fender to the top of the frame near the shock mount. There's a channel spot-welded to the underside to route the tail light wires. There are a pair of small tabs on the top of the fender, under the seat, also apparently to hold wiring in place. There are a pair of tabs near the front of the fender, broken off, which seem to be meant to attach small brackets to mount the front of the fender to the frame. There's a bracket on the top of the fender near the front, similar to the rear bracket on a Commando fender, which fits over a cross tube on the frame and is held in place with two nuts, bolts and washers. The entire assembly was chromed, and the overall shape is pretty complex: beaded edge - except for the bobbed back - shaped to fit around the chain guard and the shocks, reinforcing plates at the main mounting points.
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby Tim_S » Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:06 pm

Bill,,,,,,,,,,,,If you want contact me directly at ,,,,,,, nort75mk3@aol.com

I have a 1964 G15CS. And I know the hybrid guru guy in the UK who can answer your questions. I have a 1964 CW Mag article about my bike.


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Re: G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Wed Apr 03, 2013 6:58 pm

I've decided to use the regular G15CS rear fender for the restoration. The fender I have will go in the attic. I think what may have happened was the original alloy fender cracked around the mounts, and the dealer installed a CSR chrome fender to placate the original owner. As far as I know, this fender never came on a CS.

On to another item. Finished taking the chassis apart, and started on the engine yesterday. Cleaned off the head and cylinder, ready to go to the machine shop for dipping and re-bore. Valves and guides look pretty good. If they clean up well, I'll just lap them in. Otherwise, I guess new valves and guides.

When I got to the primary, it was a different story. After soaking the screws overnight, they still wouldn't budge. Decided to drill of the cheeseheads rather than risk breaking the inner or outer primary. After drilling out all 14 screws and an hour of careful prising, this is what I found:
Image

I've got the clutch spring nuts soaking overnight, along with the adjusting screw. Also got the rotor off. It should clean up OK. Could be worse :roll:
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby grandpaul » Thu Apr 04, 2013 7:15 am

YEEF!!!

that's got to be the worst I've ever seen.
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby cjandme » Fri Apr 05, 2013 4:28 am

Yep I gotta chime in on this too----Double YEEF--- that's pretty bad in there, but as you say it could be worse. at least you had success getting it apart without damaging the primary ...well done. The primary on the MKIII that I got last year was pretty bad, as it had been sitting outside up in Maine for years, but I must admit it wasn't as far gone as that one you've got there. Still I see a "glass half full" kinda view of it. :wink: Cj
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby kingdaddyo » Fri Apr 05, 2013 5:46 am

That is amazing. What got in it that so corroded all the guts? I have never seen anything look like that. I am glad you were at least able to salvage it. I am afraid my lack of patience would not have served me well had it been me. There are times when one should just "walk away" for a bit.

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Re: G15 Questions

Postby grandpaul » Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:45 am

I can't wait to see the "before & after" comparison photos on this one. "Dramatic" is the word that springs to mind.
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:23 pm

Update on the G15...

Primary is cleaned up and at the welders, getting 5 screw holes filled, due to the excessive corrosion

Cylinder, Crank, rods, rings and pistons are at the machine shop. Cylinders will be bored and the rotating mass balanced to 84%

I've bead blasted all the aluminum, and I'm starting to polish those pieces that get polished.

I've wire wheeled all the fasteners and brackets, and have a bucket ready to take down to Airco for a clear cad coating on Monday

Tach and Speedo are back from Joel.

Still need to have a long conversation with Mike at Walridge, and order the missing stuff

Another week or two, and I'll start putting things together 8)
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby BillT » Sun Sep 22, 2013 6:39 pm

Been working steadily on the G15 over the past several months. Trying feverishly to finish the bike and bring it to Barber in less than 3 weeks.

Found out a lot about the bike since first getting it. It's a late 1967, dispatched in July, and is titled as a 1968, which is pretty common (my Ranger is also titled as a '68). I am apparently the third owner, and when I start it up, it will be the first time in 40 years.

I've got a bunch of pics, but to make a long story short, here's what it looks like as of this afternoon.
Image
Image

And what it looked like 5 weeks ago...
Image

The only real obstacle to starting is the lack of a wiring harness. I had gotten one back in June, but didn't open it until Labor Day weekend (31 August-2 September for those outside the US). The harness was for a magneto bike, not a distributor bike. As it was a holiday weekend, it was nearly a week before I got it resolved with the vendor. Simple swap of harnesses, except the one I need is still en route from the UK. I'm supposed to get it about 26 Sept.

Short list of things yet to do:
Install harness
Wire up ignition
Re-do instrument light wires
Fit headlight to bucket
Mount horn/dip switch
Mount stator to cover and join primary
Lubricate cables
Fill fluids
Register the bike and get the tag (number plate)

If I get the harness by Thursday, I will start it on Saturday. If I don't get the harness by Thursday, I'll just wire the ignition to the battery and start it up anyway
'73 Norton 850 Commando - 3030xx
'69 Norton Ranger 750 - P11/1289xx
'67 Matchless G15CS - G15CS/1235xx
'61 Matchless G80CS - 61/G80CS/41xx
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Re: G15 Questions

Postby beng » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:03 am

Bernhard wrote:
Paul Webb wrote:Hi Bill, The instrument bracket is the same as Norton Atlas/650SS (similar to the P11 but slightly different hole centres) as they too are Norton Roadholder.
ATB. Paul.
Dommi Roadholders fork yolks had 7 inch centres, Atlas/Commando 7 3/8 inch.
Don’t assume that the bike will follow the sales literature as it does not always follow the style that left the factory.


We have the usual supermarket of misinformation here. First of all the speedo tach bracket in the photo is one that was never, ever put on an Atlas or 650ss featherbed bike for sure. Also, the change in fork centers from 7" to 7 3/8" has absolutely nothing to do with the model of the bike, it was an across the board change for all Norton heavy twins after a certain serial number at the end of 1963 or the beginning of 1964. Atlas bikes first appeared in 1962 and they had the same 7" center forks as all other heavy Nortons!

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